...apreciated...heard a business idea i so wanted to steal on bill simmons podcast a couple days ago...his buddy Kevin Wilkes pitching "too much" chips...as in BBQ, or Salt & Vinegar but way too much extra powder...this being the land of excess i was wondering how the heck this brand and idea doesn't exist yet...so anyhow let me posit it to you sensei...what are good business models built on the idea of offering excess, and in general how do you feel about a brand first business model...TOO MUCH as a brand is ridiculously easy to pivot into whatever product you might want...the ad and copy is pre-written in the concept...does it ever work to start from your marketing/branding and work backwards into a product?...
Same line of thought, think about those pizza joints or steak houses that have that mega item on their menu. The gigantic pie, or "The heartstopper" burger. None of those drive direct revenue that's meaningful, but they do serve as an interesting hook to customers, and some earned media. In that sense, they may help bring in more customers for the regular stuff--the bread and butter product.
With the chip/crisps example, I could see Dorito's launching an insanely seasoned chip to generate some buzz. Maybe "the crazy hot and dusty one". I think it would get people trying it (perhaps even a tiktok trend), but ultimately, a very small % them would *regularly* buy it. Again, a novelty that wears off.
Personally...the excess idea is not my cup of tea. I think it would be hard to build a long-term product off it. In part, because the most obvious area to build an excess product (outside of luxury things which is a different convo), is food. And the food companies spend A TON on R&D, and I think the sweet spot for flavors, seasoning, etc, in the market is what we see on the shelves.
AKA--I *think* they've validated excess is not a huge demand.
All that's to say...I think excess can be an interesting marketing play, cool creative, cool campaigns, but IMO is not enough to stand by itself as a product. I could be wrong though. And for short-term products--D2C things with quick marketing pushes--I could see some bucks to be made.
And to your last point about brand before product, that's an interesting one. It's possible if you're a great marketer to generate buzz and get people buy into some future idea (...Fyre festival...), which makes it easier to sell a product when you have it. But, even in the Fyre example, I don't even think they had brand yet, and they still teased what the product was going to be. Ultimately, they just had huge awareness and hype. If the festival was pulled off, and well, then they'd have had a brand to keep using for more festivals.
In the tech world, my mind jumps to products with waitlists. But still, they market a product.
As a PM I am biased...but I think a good product is how you build a good brand. Exceeding expectations of customers, and them believing you can keep doing it for them. Again, I'm sure brand-first can be done, but don't think it's a reliable GTM. An epic one if landed, but not reliable.
...all extremely sound logic...both of the ideas definitely reek of empty calories and as such i was struggling myself to think of good examples, especially for a brand first product...seems especially hard to develop something meaningful from the meaningless unless you are deliberately doing dada...thanks for the detailed response...great article and thoughts as always!...
...another banger good week good work...
The man, the legend. Thanks a lot! 🙏
...apreciated...heard a business idea i so wanted to steal on bill simmons podcast a couple days ago...his buddy Kevin Wilkes pitching "too much" chips...as in BBQ, or Salt & Vinegar but way too much extra powder...this being the land of excess i was wondering how the heck this brand and idea doesn't exist yet...so anyhow let me posit it to you sensei...what are good business models built on the idea of offering excess, and in general how do you feel about a brand first business model...TOO MUCH as a brand is ridiculously easy to pivot into whatever product you might want...the ad and copy is pre-written in the concept...does it ever work to start from your marketing/branding and work backwards into a product?...
I mean the immediate example that comes to mind are like those giant milkshakes (https://abcnews.go.com/Lifestyle/giant-milkshakes-drawing-huge-crowds-york-city/story?id=36376855) -- they had their moment because they were Insta worth. Pulled in good foot traffic. Not sure the longevity though...feels like a novelty product.
Same line of thought, think about those pizza joints or steak houses that have that mega item on their menu. The gigantic pie, or "The heartstopper" burger. None of those drive direct revenue that's meaningful, but they do serve as an interesting hook to customers, and some earned media. In that sense, they may help bring in more customers for the regular stuff--the bread and butter product.
With the chip/crisps example, I could see Dorito's launching an insanely seasoned chip to generate some buzz. Maybe "the crazy hot and dusty one". I think it would get people trying it (perhaps even a tiktok trend), but ultimately, a very small % them would *regularly* buy it. Again, a novelty that wears off.
Personally...the excess idea is not my cup of tea. I think it would be hard to build a long-term product off it. In part, because the most obvious area to build an excess product (outside of luxury things which is a different convo), is food. And the food companies spend A TON on R&D, and I think the sweet spot for flavors, seasoning, etc, in the market is what we see on the shelves.
AKA--I *think* they've validated excess is not a huge demand.
All that's to say...I think excess can be an interesting marketing play, cool creative, cool campaigns, but IMO is not enough to stand by itself as a product. I could be wrong though. And for short-term products--D2C things with quick marketing pushes--I could see some bucks to be made.
And to your last point about brand before product, that's an interesting one. It's possible if you're a great marketer to generate buzz and get people buy into some future idea (...Fyre festival...), which makes it easier to sell a product when you have it. But, even in the Fyre example, I don't even think they had brand yet, and they still teased what the product was going to be. Ultimately, they just had huge awareness and hype. If the festival was pulled off, and well, then they'd have had a brand to keep using for more festivals.
In the tech world, my mind jumps to products with waitlists. But still, they market a product.
As a PM I am biased...but I think a good product is how you build a good brand. Exceeding expectations of customers, and them believing you can keep doing it for them. Again, I'm sure brand-first can be done, but don't think it's a reliable GTM. An epic one if landed, but not reliable.
...all extremely sound logic...both of the ideas definitely reek of empty calories and as such i was struggling myself to think of good examples, especially for a brand first product...seems especially hard to develop something meaningful from the meaningless unless you are deliberately doing dada...thanks for the detailed response...great article and thoughts as always!...
This post was of exceptional quality. Thanks Jaryd.
Thanks so much, Gianfranco! Really appreciate the kind words!
Haha, thanks for quoting my content Re: PRD writing!